[Abbenay] update link

[Viktor Lindberg]

On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 06:50:43PM +0100, Hedvig Skirgård wrote:
> I'll answer in your email. It's not very well written all of it but I'm in a
> hurry sorta and I don't mean to sound annoyed if i do sometimes i just don't
> have the time to formulate my sentences in the way I might have liked to.
>

No problem, everything that can be said can be said clearly, to quote
an old idiot.
 
> 2009/12/14 Viktor Lindberg <leth at leth.yi.org>
> 
> > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 03:44:17PM +0100, Hedvig Skirgård wrote:
> > > Dosen't this merely underline the fact that hackerspaces in Sweden would
> > > benefit from knowing more about each other?
> >
> > Hackerspaces all over the world can learn a lot from each other, and
> > to my knowledge stockholm has not had an publicly known and open
> > hackerspace before. If you know of one please inform me since i'm
> > interested in knowing about any such thing.
> >
> >
> Well, we're starting one now as you now and it is open to the public every
> thuesday from 18.00 and  hopefully we'll get some more equipment and people
> soon.
> Does anyone have any ideas about how we could spread the word?

This was just a note on the previous discussion.
I can think of several channels to spread the word, and as soon as we
have a clear and actuall space i'll be glad to do so.

> The way I see it starting something like a hackerspace, a project or a
> organzation is in steps.
> 1) first you define the aim and the purpose
> 2) you check out what minimum resources you need and get them
> 3) you spread information about said purpose and set up a meeting
> 4) you define rules if any, how to organize and where responsibility lies
> 5) you slowly build up a group and continue discussion about purpose etc
> 6) you do stuff
> 7) you spread the word again, this time with way more to say

Yes and this is the process we are in now i'd say.

> > I had been to Proxxi before Abbenay existed, so had some others in Abbenay
> > > but the majority had not. I was not under the impression that Proxxi was
> > an
> > > hackerspace but obviously I stand corrected.
> >
> > I've been to proxxi several times, but never got the impression of it
> > being a hackerspace/hacklab either. For me it's more of a locale for
> > several diffrent organisations with interests in computers and or
> > games in any aspect. There is a lot of old harware there and i know
> > SU(G)A uses the location for their meetings, well used (i don't know if
> > it's still active). Also i've heard SLUG used to hang around there but
> > i also recently heard they use the same location we've been at recently
> > (and also that they have some connection to FUF, is that true?) (this
> > all seems strange to me as neither SLUG or IX is specificly for the
> > youth but is not FUF directed to the youth somehow?)
> > Anyways the location is alright but not suitable as a hackerspace when i
> > saw it the last time, since it doesn't offer good spaces for working
> > with hardware. But there is certainly an interesting and nice place.
> >
> 
> Young researchers is a so called youth organization with the aim to promote
> the interest of science (nature science mind you) and technology among young
> people (7-24). We (I am a member of the board for the sthockholm discrict)
> get money from the governments board of youth for these activities. Sthlm
> dis. also get money from the sthlm municipality.
> SUA, IX, SLUG are all part or proxxi still and as such also members of FUF.

Thank you for clearing that out.

> I think I can say quite confindently that we in UFS board would veyr much
> like it if Abbenay would connect with other members of UFS and maybe hold
> workshops for them and interested young people. That being said, it's not
> essential for UFs approval of Abbenay and we do realise that Abbenay needs
> more time but I'm merely throwing it out there as a suggestion.
> Collaboration with other UFS-föreningar could also mean that we could buy
> things we want together or have projects together.
 
I think the idea of collaborating with UFS is a great idea, but i
don't i don't feel that abbenay is specifically an organisation for
the youth. Having that said i am very much for the idea of having
workshops directed for the youth perhaps as a joint effort with UFS
but i really do feel that abbenay as such should be open for
individuals of any age. 

> As for Abbenay and having a real hackerspace in Stockholm i'd like to
> > see a good location where we could store hardware and actually build
> > stuff. I'm not entirely sure using UFS is best either, but then again
> > having a location for free is never bad, i just don't feel like
> > occupying too much of their space for us, since there are other
> > organisations active there that surely also have the right to use the
> > space. If we could come with an agreement with UFS i don't mind making
> > a workshop ther either, i think it's a great idea i just don't want to
> > intrude on their other interests. If we make a workshop there i
> > suggest we make one that could be used by whatever other organisations
> > that spend time there. Also we could fix more computers for
> > usage. This ofcourse is possible in proxxi aswell where they have lot's
> > of stuff already.
> >
> >
> This has been up for discussion in the board of UFS (Young researchers
> sthlms dis.) and there is definitely possibilities that we can have a
> workshop area that others use aswell. At the moment, there is less activity
> in the office than we in the board would like there to be so the fact that
> abbenay is there is no problem at all as long as Abbenay respects the
> whishes of the board and there has so far been no trouble whatsoever (except
> for the discussion about political statements and illegal acitvites which,
> mind you all, resulted in that Abbenay said that we will not make statements
> as a group promoting illegal acitvites and we will be open for everybody not
> matter political opinions. Members have to accept our bylaws though.).

As for the bylaws that you have, it would be interesting to hear or
read them, and i very much like the idea of building a workshop in the
UFS location that could be used for abbenay and any other organisation
associated with UFS/FUF or for that matter anyone else. And i also
volunteer on helping out in building it.

And as a loose organisation of hackers, promoting illegal activities
is not advised imho, but using the word hacker to describe ourselves
does tend to draw attention from the law enforcement aswell as from
individuals interested in illegal activities. The discussion on the
word is long but i do like the idea of reclaiming it.
 
> > I would like to point out though that i think it's important that a
> > hackerspace is actually a space, somewhere were you could hack and
> > meet other hackers and join up for interesting projects. Somewhere
> > with tools, good working areas and people that could help out with
> > either expertise or just a helping hand and an open mind.
> >
> > The dicusssion of proxxi versus UFS has been brought up several times and
> quite frankly I'm very dissapointed since i've gotten so few respones. We
> even had a meeting about this and the organization of abbenay and only
> myself, Axel, Ged and Seb showed up.

Well considering the prospect of a workbench at UFS and the lack of
space (to my knowledge) at proxxi, i'd vote for UFS but i can't say i
i base that vote on a great deal of research.

> I'm acutally becoming more and more optimistic about young researchers
> office space each day. I will make a quick list of why I'm so optimistic
> 
> 1) it's a clean slate, there is no activity there except for that of the
> board and the place is new which means we can be a part of shaping it
> 2) we can have meetings there quite very often as long as we make it known
> to others who might use the space (this is my responsibilty and I have done
> this)
> 3) we can store things there, it's not yet decided how much but I'm
> optimistic about that to especially after all of the renovations are done
> (which I'm sorry to say is not sure)

I like all the points here, specificall i think it's important to be
able to both store things and to have a reall workshop to build and
perform experiments.

> > With that said, i'm asking do we really have a good place now? is us
> > staying at UFS really ok for them? can we transform a part of their
> > location into a working area? If we can't then perhaps we should start
> > looking for another location? I'm sure proxxi wouldn't turn us down
> > as long as we are paying members, but i'm not so sure they really have
> > space for workbenches and tools.
> >
> >
> Again, I am a member of the board of UFS and the space that we in UFS are
> providing for Abbenay is our office but it is also meant to be a place where
> "föreningar" (loosely: organizations) can hold meetings and other
> activities. Abbenay is a member of UFS. It is well within Abbenays rights to
> use this space. That being said, I'm the only one on abbenay with a key and
> that means that I have to be present when the space is used. UFS next board
> meeting is on wednesday and the subject of giving axel and seb a key to
> share will be brought up.
> 
> We have talked a lot about other places and I know that we haven't talked
> much about this with new members and I like it that this subject is being
> brought up again.

I think taht for now UFS is good, and if we can help them out building
a workshop that is great even if we might decide we need some other
place later on.

> Like i said, we have in UFS talked about transforming a part of the office
> to a workshop. That discussion died when Abbenay started hanging out in the
> squat. But I'll bring it up on wednesday and report back to abbenay on
> thursday.

Please try to get some specific information on how we are allowed to
do this if we get the permission to do so, i would love to see very
specific specifications on what we may do and if there is material
somwhere that we might do, such as a table stored somwehere we might
use, or if someone who as a great deal of information and could
represent UFS (you?) could be there and help out with the finding
material and or specification on how we may build the workshop.
I would love to get started with this so we can start trying to set up
a good place to solder/desolder.

> (Quote from dagordning "===Verkstadsdel i lokalen===
> Hedvig undrar vad andra i styrelsen tycker om förslaget att använda en del
> av lokalen som en liten verkstad med en arbetsbänk och möjligheter till att
> lagra råmaterial som metall, skruvar, sladdar osv samt hänga upp verktyg på
> väggen.")
> 
> /Hed.

And thank you again for making this happening.

/leth